Question: What is it that comes when nationalism goes?
问题：民族主义消失时会发生什么？
Krishnamurti: Obviously, intelligence. But I am afraid that is not the implication in this question. The implication is, what can be substituted for nationalism? Any substitution is an act which does not bring intelligence. If I leave one religion and join another, or leave one political party and later on join something else, this constant substitution indicates a state in which there is no intelligence.
克里希那穆提：显然，智慧。 但恐怕这不是这个问题的含义。 言下之意是，什么可以代替民族主义？ 任何替代都是一种不能带来智慧的行为。 如果我离开一个宗教而加入另一个宗教，或者离开一个政党，后来加入另一个政党， 这种不断的替换表明一种没有智慧的状态。
How does nationalism go? Only by our understanding its full implications, by examining it, by being aware of its significance in outward and inward action. Outwardly it brings about divisions between people, classifications, wars and destruction, which is obvious to anyone who is observant.
民族主义如何去何从？ 只有我们理解它的全部含义， 通过检查它，通过意识到它外在和内在的行动的意义。 从外在来看，它带来了人与人之间的分裂、等级、战争和毁灭， 对任何留心于观察的人来说，这都是显而易见的。
Inwardly, psychologically, this identification with the greater, with the country, with an idea, is obviously a form of self-expansion. Living in a little village or a big town or whatever it may be, I am nobody; but if I identify myself with the larger, with the country, if I call myself a Hindu, it flatters my vanity, it gives me gratification, prestige, a sense of well-being; and that identification with the larger, which is a psychological necessity for those who feel that self-expansion is essential, also creates conflict, strife, between people.
内在的，心理上， 这种对更伟大的、对国家、对一个理念的认同，显然是一种自我扩张的形式。 生活在一个小村庄或大城市或其他任何地方，我默默无闻； 但如果我认同更伟大的，认同国家，如果我称自己为印度教徒，它就会奉承我的虚荣心， 它给我满足感、声望和舒适感； 和那个更大的相认同， 对于那些觉得自我扩张是必不可少的的人来说，这是一种心理上的需要， 也造成了人与人之间的冲突、纷争。
Thus nationalism not only creates outward conflict but inward frustrations; when one understands nationalism, the whole process of nationalism, it falls away. The understanding of nationalism comes through intelligence, by carefully observing, by probing into the whole process of nationalism, patriotism. Out of that examination comes intelligence and then there is no substitution of something else for nationalism.
因此，民族主义不仅造成外在的冲突，而且造成内在的挫折； 当一个人理解民族主义，民族主义的整个过程时，它就消失了。 对民族主义的理解来自智慧， 通过仔细观察，通过探索民族主义、爱国主义的整个过程。 从这种检查中产生出智慧，然后就没有其他东西可以代替民族主义。
The moment you substitute religion for national1sm, religion becomes another means of self-expansion, another source of psychological anxiety, a means of feeding oneself through a belief. Therefore any form of substitution, however noble, is a form of ignorance. It is like a man substituting chewing gum or betel nut or whatever it is for smoking, whereas if one really understands the whole problem of smoking, of habits, sensations, psychological demands and all the rest of it, then smoking drops away.
当你用宗教代替民族的那一刻， 宗教就变成了另一种自我扩张的手段， 心理焦虑的另一个来源，是一种通过信仰养活自己的手段。 因此，任何形式的替代，无论多么高尚，都是一种无知。 这就像一个人用口香糖或槟榔或其他任何东西代替吸烟， 然而，如果一个人真的理解 吸烟整个问题，习惯，感觉，心理需求以及所有其他问题， 那么，烟灭了。
You can understand only when there is a development of intelligence, when intelligence is functioning, and intelligence is not functioning when there is substitution. Substitution is merely a form of self-bribery, to tempt you not to do this but to do that. Nationalism, with its poison, with its misery and world strife, can disappear only when there is intelligence, and intelligence does not come merely by passing examinations and studying books. Intelligence comes into being when we understand problems as they arise.
只有当智慧发生运转时，你才能理解， 当有替代品时，智慧不起作用。 替代只是一种自我贿赂的形式，诱惑你不要做这，而是做那。 民族主义及其毒药、苦难和世界冲突，只有在有智慧的情况下才能消失， 智慧不仅仅是通过考试和学习书籍。 当问题冒出并被我们理解时，智慧出现。
When there is understanding of the problem at its different levels, not only of the outward part but of its inward, psychological implications, then, in that process, intelligence comes into being. So when there is intelligence there is no substitution; and when there is intelligence, then nationalism, patriotism, which is a form of stupidity, disappears.
当对问题有各个层面的理解， 不仅在外层，而且在它的内里，在心理上的影响， 那么，在这个过程中，智慧就有了。 因此，当有智慧时，就没有替代品； 当有智慧时，民族主义，爱国主义，也就是某种愚蠢的形式，就会消失。