Question: Gossip has value in self-revelation, especially in revealing others to me. Seriously, why not use gossip as a means of discovering what is? I do not shiver at the word `gossip' just because it has been condemned for ages.
问题：闲谈在自我揭露方面有价值，尤其是在向我揭露他人方面。 说真的，为什么不使用闲谈作为发现是什么的手段呢？ 我不会因为“闲谈”这个词被谴责很长时间而颤抖。
Krishnamurti: I wonder why we gossip? Not because it reveals others to us. And why should others be revealed to us? Why do you want to know others? Why this extraordinaly concern about others? First of all, why do we gossip? It is a form of restlessness, is it not?
我想知道我们为什么闲谈？ 不是因为它向我们揭露了他人。为什么要向我们揭露他人？ 你为什么想知道他人？为什么非常担忧他人？ 首先，我们为什么要闲谈？ 它是一种躁动，不是吗？
Like worry, it is an indication of a restless mind. Why this desire to interfere with others, to know what others are doing, saying? It is a very superficial mind that gossips, isn't it? - an inquisitive mind which is wrongly directed.
像忧虑一样，它是不安分的头脑的表现。 为什么有这种干涉他人，想知道他人在做什么，说什么的欲望？ 一种非常肤浅的头脑才会去闲谈，不是吗？ —— 那是一个被错误引导的好奇的头脑。
The questioner seems to think that others are revealed to him by his being concerned with them - with their doings, with their thoughts, with their opinions. But do we know others if we don't know ourselves? Can we judge others, if we do not know the way of our own thinking, the way we act, the way we behave? Why this extraordinary concern over others?
提问者似乎认为，要揭露他们，可以通过对他们的关心 —— 他们的所作所为，他们的思想，他们的观点。 但是，如果我们不认识我们自己，我们能知道他人吗？ 如果我们不知道自己的思考方式，我们的行动方式，我们的行为举止，我们能评判他人吗？ 为什么对他人如此特别的关心？
Is it not an escape, really, this desire to find out what others are thinking and feeling and gossiping about? Doesn't it offer an escape from ourselves? Is there not in it also the desire to interfere with others' lives? Isn't our own life sufficiently difficult, sufficiently complex, sufficiently painful, without dealing with others', interfering with others'?
这种想知道他人在想什么、感受什么和闲谈什么的欲望，不正是一种逃避吗？ 难道它没有为我们提供一种逃避吗？ 难道其中没有干涉他人生活的欲望吗？ 难道我们自己的生命还不够困难，不够复杂，不够痛苦， 还有精力去干涉他人吗？
Is there time to think about others in that gossipy, cruel, ugly manner? Why do we do this? You know, everybody does it. Practically everybody gossips about somebody else. Why?
有时间去以那种闲谈、残忍、丑陋的方式去考量他人吗？ 我们为什么要这样做？ 你知道，每个人都这样做。 几乎每个人都在闲谈他人。为什么？
I think, first of all, we gossip about others because we are not sufficiently interested in the process of our own thinking and of our own action. We want to see what others are doing and perhaps, to put it kindly, to imitate others. Generally, when we gossip it is to condemn others, but, stretching it charitably, it is perhaps to imitate others.
我认为，首先，我们闲谈他人 因为我们对自己的思考过程和行动不够感兴趣。 我们想看看他人在做什么，也许，说得客气一点，模仿他人。 一般来说，当我们闲谈时，是在谴责他人， 也可能是，仁慈地延伸它，也许是为了模仿他人。
Why do we want to imitate others? Doesn't it all indicate an extraordinary shallowness on our own part? It is an extraordinarily dull mind that wants excitement, and goes outside itself to get it. In other words gossip is a form of sensation, isn't it?, in which we indulge.
我们为什么要模仿他人？ 这一切不都表明我们自己异常肤浅吗？ 它是一颗异常迟钝的头脑想要刺激，想摆脱它自己，想去捕获。 换句话说，闲谈是一种感觉，不是吗？而我们沉迷其中。
It may be a different kind of sensation, but there is always this desire to find excitement, distraction. If one really goes into this question deeply, one comes back to oneself, which shows that one is really extraordinarily shallow and seeking excitement from outside by talking about others.
它可能是一种不同的感觉，但总有一种寻找兴奋、分心的欲望。 如果一个人真的深入探讨这个问题，他就会回到自己身上， 暴露出一个人极度肤浅，通过谈论他人来寻求外在的刺激。
Catch yourself the next time you are gossiping about somebody; if you are aware of it, it will indicate an awful lot to you about yourself. Don't cover it up by saying that you are merely inquisitive about others. It indicates restlessness, a sense of excitement, a shallowness, a lack of real, profound interest in people which has nothing to do with gossip.
下次你闲谈某人时，抓住你自己； 如果你觉察到这一点，它会向你展示很多关于你自己的信息。 不要说你只是对别人好奇，用它来打掩护。 它表明了你的急躁，一种兴奋感，一种肤浅，一种实质上的匮乏。 对人的浓厚兴趣，与闲谈无关。
The next problem is, how to stop gossip. That is the next question, isn't it? When you are aware that you are gossiping, how do you stop gossiping? If it has become a habit, an ugly thing that continues day after day, how do you stop it? Does that question arise? When you know you are gossiping, when you are aware that you are gossiping, aware of all its implications, do you then say to yourself, "How am I to stop it?"
下一个问题是，如何停止闲谈。这是下一个问题，不是吗？ 当你意识到自己在闲谈时，你如何停止闲谈？ 如果它已经成为一种习惯，一种日复一日地持续下去的丑陋事情，你如何阻止它？ 这个问题会出现吗？ 当你知道你在闲谈，当你意识到你在闲谈，意识到它的所有含义， 然后你是否对自己说：“我该如何阻止它？”
Does it not stop of its own accord, the moment you are aware that you are gossiping? The 'how' does not arise at all. The `how' arises only when you are unaware; and gossip indicates a lack of awareness. Experiment with this for yourself the next time you are gossiping, and see how quickly, how immediately you stop gossiping when you are aware of what you are talking about, aware that your tongue is running away with you.
难道它不会在你觉察到自己在闲谈的那一刻自动停下吗？ “如何”根本不会出现。 “如何”只有在你没有觉察的时候才会出现；闲谈指示出你缺乏觉察。 下次你在闲谈时，你自己做实验， 当你觉察到你在说什么， 觉察到你的舌头不受你指挥的时候， 看看你有多快，多么迅速地停下了闲谈。
It does not demand the action of will to stop it. All that is necessary is to be aware, to be conscious of what you are saying and to see the implications of it. You don't have to condemn or justify gossip. Be aware of it and you will see how quickly you stop gossiping; because it reveals to oneself one's own ways of action, one's behaviour, thought pattern; in that revelation, one discovers oneself, which is far more important than gossiping about others, about what they are doing, what they are thinking, how they behave.
它不需要人的意愿来阻止。 只需觉察，意识到你在说什么，看到其中的含义。 你不必对闲谈谴责或辩护。 觉察它，你会看到你停止闲谈的速度有多快； 因为它自发地揭露了一个人的行动方式、行为举止、思考模式； 在那个揭露中，一个人发现自己， 这比闲谈他人，他们在做什么，他们在想什么，他们如何表现等等，重要得多。
Most of us who read daily newspapers are filled with gossip, global gossip. It is all an escape from ourselves, from our own pettiness, from our own ugliness. We think that through a superficial interest in world events we are becoming more and more wise, more capable of dealing with our own lives. All these, surely, are ways of escaping from ourselves, are they not?
我们大多数阅读日报的人都充满了闲谈，全球泛滥的闲谈。 这一切都是在逃避我们自己，逃避我们自己的琐碎，逃避我们自己的丑陋。 我们认为，通过对世界事件的肤浅兴趣 我们变得越来越有睿智，越来越有能力处理自己的生活。 显然，所有这些做法都是在逃避我们自己，不是吗？
In ourselves we are so empty, shallow; we are so frightened of ourselves. We are so poor in ourselves that gossip acts as a form of rich entertainment, an escape from ourselves. We try to fill that emptiness in us with knowledge, with rituals, with gossip, with group meetings - with the innumerable ways of escape, so the escapes become all-important, and not the understanding of what is.
在我们自己里面，我们是那么空虚，肤浅；我们太害怕自己了。 我们自己是如此贫乏，以至于闲谈是一种丰富的娱乐形式，一种逃避自我。 我们试图用知识、仪式、闲谈、小组会议来填补我们内心的空虚。 —— 有了无数的逃跑方式，所以，逃跑变得至关重要， 而不是对此刻的理解。
The understanding of what is demands attention; to know that one is empty, that one is in pain, needs immense attention and not escapes, but most of us like these escapes, because they are much more pleasurable, more pleasant. Also, when we know ourselves as we are, it is very difficult to deal with ourselves; that is one of the problems with which we are faced. We don't know what to do. When I know that I am empty, that I am suffering, that I am in pain, I don't know what to do, how to deal with it. So one resorts to all kinds of escapes.
对当前的理解，需要注意力； 要知道一个人空虚，一个人所受的痛苦，需要巨大的注意力而非逃避， 但我们大多数人都喜欢这些逃避，因为它们让人爽感，讨人喜欢。 此外，当我们知道我们自己的样子时，很难打理我们自己； 这是我们面临的问题之一。 我们不知道该怎么办。 当我知道我是空虚的，我在受苦受难，我处在痛苦之中， 我不知道该怎么办，如何打理它。所以一个人诉诸于各种逃避。
The question is, what to do? Obviously, of course, one cannot escape; for that is most absurd and childish. But when you are faced with yourself as you are, what are you to do? First, is it possible not to deny or justify it but just to remain with it, as you are? - which is extremely arduous, because the mind seeks explanation, condemnation, identification.
问题是，做什么？ 显然，当然，一个人不能逃；因为这是最荒谬和幼稚的。 但是当你面对你自己时，你做什么？ 首先，是否有可能不拒绝或争辩，而只是如实地与其相处？ —— 这是极其艰巨的，因为头脑寻求解释、谴责、认同。
If it does not do any of those things but remains with it, then it is like accepting something. If I accept that I am brown, that is the end of it; but if I am desirous of changing to a lighter colour, then the problem arises. To accept what is is most difficult; one can do that only when there is no escape and condemnation or justification is a form of escape.
如果它不做任何这些事情，而是驻留于此，那么它就像接受某个东西一样。 如果我接受我是棕色肤质的人，那就是它的了结； 但是，如果我想换成较浅的肤色，那问题就出现了。 接受是什么，是最困难的； 只有当没有逃避，谴责或辩解，没有这些逃避形式的时候，一个人才能做到。
Therefore when one understands the whole process of why one gossips and when one realizes the absurdity of it, the cruelty and all the things involved in it, then one is left with what one is; and we approach it always either to destroy it, or to change it into something else.
因此，当一个人理解闲谈的整个过程时 当一个人意识到它的荒谬，残酷和所涉及的所有事情时， 然后一个人只剩下是他自己； 当我们靠近时，要么摧毁，要么把他变成别的样子。
If we don't do either of those things but approach it with the intention of understanding it, being with it completely, then we will find that it is no longer the thing that we dreaded. Then there is a possibility of transforming that which is.
如果我们不做这些 但是带着理解的意图去接近，完全与之相处， 然后我们会发现他不再是令我们害怕的东西。 那么，就有可能转变。