Question: Is not the longing expressed in prayer a way to God?
问题：祷告中表达的渴望难道不是通往上帝的道路吗？
Krishnamurti: First of all, we are going to examine the problems contained in this question. In it are implied prayer, concentration and meditation. Now what do we mean by prayer? First of all, in prayer there is petition, supplication to what you call God, reality. You, as an individual, are demanding, petitioning, begging, seeking guidance from something which you call God; therefore your approach is one of seeking a reward, seeking a gratification. You are in trouble, national or individual, and you pray for guidance; or you are confused and you beg for clarity, you look for help to what you call God. In this is implied that God, whatever God may be - we won't discuss that for the moment - is going to clear up the confusion which you and I have created.
克里希那穆提：首先，我们将研究这个问题中包含的问题。 其中隐含着祈祷、专注和冥想。现在我们所说的祷告是什么意思呢？ 首先，在祷告中有祈求，恳求你所谓的上帝，现实。 你，作为一个个体，在要求、祈求、乞求、寻求你称之为上帝的东西的指导； 因此，你的方法是寻求奖励，寻求满足。 你陷入困境，无论是国家的还是个人的，你祈求指导； 或者你感到困惑，你乞求澄清，你寻求你所谓的上帝的帮助。 这暗示着上帝，无论上帝是什么 —— 我们暂时不讨论这位上帝 —— 将消除你和我造成的混乱。
After all, it is we who have brought about the confusion, the misery, the chaos, the appalling tyranny, the lack of love, and we want what we call God to clear it up. In other words, we want our confusion, our misery, our sorrow, our conflict, to be cleared away by somebody else, we petition another to bring us light and happiness.
毕竟，是我们带来了困惑、痛苦、混乱、骇人听闻的暴政、爱的匮乏， 我们希望我们所谓的上帝来澄清它。 换句话说， 我们希望我们的困惑，我们的痛苦，我们的悲伤，我们的冲突，被别人清除， 我们请求另一个人给我们带来光明和快乐。
Now when you pray, when you beg, petition for something, it generally comes into being. When you ask, you receive; but what you receive will not create order, because what you receive does not bring clarity, understanding. it only satisfies, gives gratification but does not bring about understanding, because, when you demand, you receive that which you yourself project. How can reality, God, answer your particular demand? Can the immeasurable, the unutterable, be concerned with our petty little worries, miseries, confusions, which we ourselves have created? Therefore what is it that answers?
现在，当你祈祷，当你乞求，祈求某事时，它通常会产生。 当你问时，你会收到；但你收到的不会创造秩序， 因为你得到的不会带来清晰、理解。 它只满足，给予满足，但不带来理解， 因为，当你要求时，你会收到你自己投射的东西。 上帝，现实如何回答你的特殊要求？ 那不可估量，不可言说的，能关心我们自己创造的琐碎的小烦恼、痛苦、困惑吗？ 因此，答案是什么？
Obviously the immeasurable cannot answer the measured, the petty, the small. But what is it that answers? At the moment when we pray we are fairly silent, in a state of receptivity; then our own subconscious brings a momentary clarity. You want something, you are longing for it, and in that moment of longing, of obsequious begging, you are fairly receptive; your conscious, active mind is comparatively still, so the unconscious projects itself into that and you have an answer. It is surely not an answer from reality, from the immeasurable - it is your own unconscious responding. So don't let us be confused and think that when your prayer is answered you are in relationship with reality. Reality must come to you; you cannot go to it.
显然，不可估量的人无法回答这小气的、琐碎的、渺小的。 但是，答案是什么呢？ 在我们祈祷的那一刻，我们相当安静，处于一种接受的状态； 然后我们自己的潜意识带来了短暂的清晰。 你想要什么，你渴望它， 在渴望、乞求的那一刻，你相当容易接受； 你的意识、活跃的头脑相对静止， 所以无意识把自己投射到其中，你就有一个答案。 这肯定不是来自现实，来自那不可估量者的答案 —— 这是你自己的无意识反应。 因此，让我们别被迷惑并认为当你的祷告得到回应时，你就与现实建立了关系。 现实必须来到你身边；你不能去它那里。
In this problem of prayer there is another factor involved: the response of that which we call the inner voice. As I said, when the mind is supplicating, petitioning, it is comparatively still; when you hear the inner voice, it is your own voice projecting itself into that comparatively still mind. Again, how can it be the voice of reality? A mind that is confused, ignorant, craving, demanding, petitioning, how can it understand. reality?
在这个祷告的问题上，还有另一个因素： 我们称之为内在声音的回应。 正如我所说，当心在恳求、祈求时，它是相对静止的； 當你聽到內在的聲音時，它是你自己的聲音投射到那個相對靜止的頭腦中。 再说一遍，它怎么可能是现实的声音？ 一个迷茫、无知、贪婪、苛求、祈求的头脑，怎么能理解呢。现实？
The mind can receive reality only when it is absolutely still, not demanding, not craving, not longing, not asking, whether for yourself, for the nation or for another. When the mind is absolutely still, when desire ceases, then only reality comes into being. A person who is demanding, petitioning, supplicating, longing for direction will find what he seeks but it will not be the truth. What he receives will be the response of the unconscious layers of his own mind which project themselves into the conscious; that still, small voice which directs him is not the real but only the response of the unconscious.
头脑要接收现实 只有当它绝对静止时，它不要求，不渴望，不期盼，不要， 无论是为了自己，为了国家或者另一个人。 當頭腦絕對靜止，當慾望停止時，只有如此，現實才會產生。 一个要求、祈求、恳求、渴望方向的人会找到他所寻求的，但它不会是真理。 他所接受的将是他自己头脑中投射到意识中的无意识层的反应； 那個靜止的、微小的聲音指導他，不是真實的，而只是無意識的反應。
In this problem of prayer there is also the question of concentration. With most of us, concentration is a process of exclusion. Concentration is brought about through effort, compulsion, direction, imitation, and so concentration is a process of exclusion. I am interested in so-called meditation but my thoughts are distracted, so I fix my mind on a picture, an image, or an idea and exclude all other thoughts. This process of concentration, which is exclusion, is considered to be a means of meditating. That is what you do, is it not?
在祷告这个问题中，还有专注的问题。 对于我们大多数人来说，专注是一个排斥的过程。 专注是通过努力、强迫、指导、模仿来实现的， 所以专注是一个排斥的过程。 我对所谓的冥想感兴趣，但我的思想走神了， 所以我把我的思想固定在一张图片、一个图像或一个想法上，排除所有其他想法。 这种专注的过程，即排除，被认为是一种冥想的手段。 这就是你所做的，不是吗？
When you sit down to meditate, you fix your mind on a word, on an image, or on a picture but the mind wanders all over the place. There is the constant interruption of other ideas, other thoughts, other emotions and you try to push them away; you spend your time battling with your thoughts. This process you call meditation.
当你坐下来冥想时，你会把你的思想固定在一个单词、一个图像或一张图片上。 但思绪到处游荡。 其他观念、其他想法、其他情绪不断中断 你试图推开它们；你花时间与你的想法作斗争。 这个过程你称之为冥想。
That is you are trying to concentrate on something in which you are not interested and your thoughts keep on multiplying, increasing, interrupting, so you spend your energy in exclusion, in warding off; pushing away; if you can concentrate on your chosen thought, on a particular object, you think you have at last succeeded in meditation. Surely that is not meditation, is it? Meditation is not an exclusive process - exclusive in the sense of warding off, building resistance against encroaching ideas. Prayer is not meditation and concentration as exclusion is not meditation.
也就是说，您正在尝试专注于您不感兴趣的事情 你的思想不停地繁殖、增加、中断， 所以你把你的精力花在排斥上，花在抵御上；推开； 如果你能专注于你选择的想法，专注于一个特定的对象， 你以為你終於成功地冥想了。 那肯定不是冥想，它是吗？ 冥想不是一个排他的过程 —— 抵御，建立对侵占思想的抵抗力的意义上的排他性。 祷告不是冥想，通过排斥而专注不是冥想。
What is meditation? Concentration is not meditation, because where there is interest it is comparatively easy to concentrate on something. A general who is planning war, butchery, is very concentrated. A business man making money is very concentrated - he may even be ruthless, putting aside every other feeling and concentrating completely on what he wants. A man who is interested in anything is naturally, spontaneously concentrated. Such concentration is not meditation, it is merely exclusion.
什么是冥想？ 专注不是冥想， 因为只要有兴趣，就更容易专注于某事。 一个正在策划战争的将军，屠夫，非常专注。 一个赚钱的商人很专注 —— 他甚至可能是无情的，抛开其他所有感觉，完全专注于他想要的东西。 一个对任何事情感兴趣的人是自然的，自发的专注。 這種專注不是冥想，它只不过是排斥。
So what is meditation? Surely meditation is understanding - meditation of the heart is understanding. How can there be understanding if there is exclusion? How can there be understanding when there is petition, supplication? In understanding there is peace, there is freedom; that which you understand, from that you are liberated.
那么什么是冥想呢？ 當然靜心就是理解 —— 心灵的冥想就是理解。 如果有排斥，怎么能理解呢？ 当有请愿、恳求时，怎么会有理解？ 在理解中，有和平，有自由； 在你所理解的，你从中解脱出来。
Merely to concentrate or to pray does not bring understanding. Understanding is the very basis, the fundamental process of meditation. You don't have to accept my word for it but if you examine prayer and concentration very carefully, deeply, you will find that neither of them leads to understanding. They merely lead to obstinacy, to a fixation, to illusion. Whereas meditation, in which there is understanding, brings about freedom, clarity and integration.
仅仅集中注意力或祈祷并不能带来理解。 理解是冥想的基礎和根本過程。 你不必接受我的话 但如果你非常仔细、深入地检查祷告和专注， 你会发现它们都不会导致理解。 它们只会导致固执，执着，幻觉。 而有理解的冥想，带来自由、清晰和融合。
What, then, do we mean by understanding? Understanding means giving right significance, right valuation, to all things. To be ignorant is to give wrong values; the very nature of stupidity is the lack of comprehension of right values. Understanding comes into being when there are right values, when right values are established.
那么，我们所说的理解是什么意思？ 理解意味着赋予所有事物正确的意义，正确的价值。 无知就是给出错误的价值观； 愚蠢的本质是缺乏对正确价值的理解。 当有正确的价值，当正确的价值建立起来时，理解就会产生。
And how is one to establish right values - the right value of property, the right value of relationship, the right value of ideas? For the right values to come into being, you must understand the thinker, must you not? If I don't understand the thinker, which is myself what I choose has no meaning; that is if I don't know myself, then my action, my thought, has no foundation whatsoever.
以及如何建立正确的价值 —— 正确的财产价值，正确的关系价值，正确的思想价值？ 要使正确的价值产生，你必须理解思想者，不是吗？ 如果我不理解思想者，我自己选择的东西就没有意义； 也就是说，如果我不知道我自己，那么我的行为，我的思想，就没有任何基础。
Therefore self-knowledge is the beginning of meditation - not the knowledge that you pick up from my books, from authorities, from gurus, but the knowledge that comes into being through self-inquiry, which is self-awareness. Meditation is the beginning of self-knowledge and without self-knowledge there is no meditation.
因此，自我认识是冥想的开始 —— 不是你从我的书、权威、大师那里学到的知识， 而是通过自我探究而产生的知识，也就是自我意识。 冥想是自我認識的開始，沒有自我認識就沒有靜心。
If I don't understand the ways of my thoughts, of my feelings, if I don't understand my motives, my desires, my demands, my pursuit of patterns of action, which are ideas - if I do not know myself, there is no foundation for thinking; the thinker who merely asks, prays, or excludes, without understanding himself, must inevitably end in confusion, in illusion.
如果我不理解我的思想，我的感受的方式， 如果我不理解我的动机，我的愿望，我的要求，我对行动准则的追求，这些都是想法 —— 如果我认识我自己，就没有思考的基础； 思想者如果只是祈求、祈祷或排斥，而不理解自己，必然会以困惑、幻觉告终。
The beginning of meditation is self-knowledge, which means being aware of every movement of thought and feeling, knowing all the layers of my consciousness, not only the superficial layers but the hidden, the deeply concealed activities. To know the deeply concealed activities, the hidden motives, responses, thoughts and feelings, there must be tranquillity in the conscious mind; that is the conscious mind must be still in order to receive the projection of the unconscious.
冥想的开始是自知之明， 这意味着要意识到思想和感觉的每一个动作， 知道自我意识的所有层次， 不仅是表面的层次，还有隐藏的、深藏的活动。 要知道隐藏的活动，隐藏的动机，反应，思想和感受， 意识中必须有宁静； 也就是说，有意识的头脑必须静止才能接收无意识的投射。
The superficial, conscious mind is occupied with its daily activities, with earning a livelihood, deceiving others, exploiting others, running away from problems - all the daily activities of our existence. That superficial mind must understand the right significance of its own activities and thereby bring tranquillity to itself. It cannot bring about tranquillity, stillness, by mere regimentation, by compulsion, by discipline. It can bring about tranquillity, peace, stillness, only by understanding its own activities, by observing them, by being aware of them, by seeing its own ruthlessness, how it talks to the servant, to the wife, to the daughter, to the mother and so on.
这个肤浅的、有意识的头脑被它的日常活动所占据 —— 谋生，欺骗别人，剥削别人，逃避问题 —— 我们现存的所有日常活动。 那个肤浅的头脑必须理解它自己活动的正确意义。 从而给它自己带来宁静。 仅仅靠约束、强迫、纪律，不能带来安宁、寂静。 要有安宁，和平，静止， 只有通过理解它自己的活动，通过观察它们，通过觉知它们， 通过看到自己的无情，它如何与仆人、妻子、女儿、母亲等交谈。
When the superficial, conscious mind is thus fully aware of all its activities, through that understanding it becomes spontaneously quiet, not drugged by compulsion or regimented by desire; then it is in a position to receive the intimation, the hints of the unconscious, of the many, many hidden layers of the mind - the racial instincts, the buried memories, the concealed pursuits, the deep wounds that are still unhealed. It is only when all these have projected themselves and are understood, when the whole consciousness is unburdened, unfettered by any wound, by any memory whatsoever, that it is in a position to receive the eternal.
当肤浅的、有意识的头脑因此完全意识到它的所有活动时， 通过这种理解，它变得自发地安静，不被强迫所麻醉，也不被欲望所束缚； 然后它就能够接收暗示，无意识的暗示，许多人的暗示， 头脑的许多隐藏层 —— 种族本能，埋藏的记忆，隐藏的追求，仍未愈合的深层伤口。 只有当所有这些都投射出来并被理解时， 当整个意识没有负担，不受任何伤口、任何记忆的束缚时， 它能够接受这种永恒。
Meditation is self-knowledge and without self-knowledge there is no meditation. If you are not aware of all your responses all the time, if you are not fully conscious, fully cognizant of your daily activities, merely to lock yourself in a room and sit down in front of a picture of your guru, of your Master, to meditate, is an escape, because without self-knowledge there is no right thinking and, without right thinking, what you do has no meaning, however noble your intentions are.
冥想是自我认识，没有自我认识就无法冥想。 如果您一直不知道自己的所有回应， 如果您没有完全地意识，完全意识到您的日常活动， 仅仅把自己锁在一个房间里，坐在你的上师、你的师父的照片前冥想，是一种逃避， 因为没有自知之明就没有正确的思考， 没有正确的思考，你的所作所为就没有意义，无论你的意图有多么崇高。
Thus prayer has no significance without self-knowledge but when there is self-knowledge there is right thinking and hence right action. When there is right action, there is no confusion and therefore there is no supplication to someone else to lead you out of it. A man who is fully aware is meditating; he does not pray, because he does not want anything. Through prayer, through regimentation, through repetition and all the rest of it, you can bring about a certain stillness, but that is mere dullness, reducing the mind and the heart to a state of weariness. it is drugging the mind; and exclusion, which you call concentration, does not lead to reality - no exclusion ever can.
因此，没有自知之明，祷告就没有意义 但是，当有自我认识时，就会有正确的思考，从而有正确的行动。 当有正确的行动时， 没有困惑，因此没有恳求别人带领你走出它。 一个完全觉知的人正在冥想；他不祷告，因为他什么都不想要。 通过祈祷，通过训练，通过重复和所有其他的，你可以带来某种静止， 但那只是迟钝，使头脑和心灵陷入疲惫。 它在给头脑下药； 而排除，你称之为专注，不会导致现实 —— 任何排斥都不可能。
What brings about understanding is self-knowledge, and it is not very difficult to be aware if there is right intention. If you are interested to discover the whole process of yourself - not merely the superficial part but the total process of your whole being - then it is comparatively easy. If you really want to know yourself, you will search out your heart and your mind to know their full content and when there is the intention to know, you will know.
带来理解的是自我认识， 而且要意识到是否有正确的意图，并不难。 如果您有兴趣去发现你自己的整个过程 —— 不仅仅是表面的部分，而是你存在的整个过程 —— 那么它就相对容易了。 如果你真的想认识你自己，你会搜索你的内心和你的思想，以知道它们的全部内容 当有去知道的意图时，你就会知道。
Then you can follow, without condemnation or justification, every movement of thought and feeling; by following every thought and every feeling as it arises you bring about tranquillity which is not compelled, not regimented, but which is the outcome of having no problem, no contradiction. It is like the pool that becomes peaceful, quiet, any evening when there is no wind; when the mind is still, then that which is immeasurable comes into being.
然后，你可以不带谴责或辩解地跟随思想和感情的每一个动作； 通过跟随每一个想法和每一个感觉，你带来宁静 这不是强迫的，不是受制的，而是没有问题，没有矛盾的结果。 它就像游泳池，在任何没有风的夜晚变得宁静，安静； 当头脑静下来的时候，无量的东西就会产生。